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My Recent Posts · (09/21/08

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Sure, it's a poem. Anything the author calls a poem is a poem...but what makes it "poetry"?

We've all been told, by now (Gee, thanks, Mr. Elliott!) that rhyme and meter aren't what does it. Free-Verse is all the rage, lately. Personally, I urge all poets to learn the forms and to write in rhyme and meter if only for the practice: this fad can't last forever, and besides, it can only improve both your vocabulary and sense of usage to work in structure.

But what DOES make poetry...poetry? What distinguishes a poem from a piece of pretty and evocative prose? Here's my opinion...

Prose is the art of making word-constructions, conveying to the reader a sense of place or of feeling through the use of language.

Poetry is the art of making the language transcend itself, and offering the reader MORE than can be explained in just the meanings of the words and sentences presented. We make use of the sounds and shapes and odd combinations of the words...we use rhythm and tension and contradiction and juxtaposition...we use, even, the visual shape of the poem itself as it flows down the page, to present a whole greater than the sum of its defined parts.

Poetry is, oddly, not as popular as it once was (though you couldn't tell it by the number of Internet poetry forums, could you?) A chart of recent sales of poetic anthologies would make a picture of a really challenging down-hill ski course. Personally, I attribute this to the recent upsurge in technology...we no longer have to hire a band to hear music, we can turn on a radio, and music completes poetry in many ways. Now we buy albums instead of books of rhymes.

So, given that...maybe poetry is still just as popular as ever...we just take it with accompaniment. By far, our biggest exposure to poetic expression comes as lyrics, and that's a real good place to look for the things that make poetry work. For an example of how a line of poetry can offer more than the words actually say, I'd like to present one of my personal favorites...a song performed by Brooks and Dunn called "Texas and Norma Jean". (Don't like Country Music? Well, don't worry about it, we all have our shortcomings. I promise, I won't sing it.)

Texas and Norma Jean

v1
It was a foggy morning, south of San Jose.
We were sittin' in a crowded coffee shop with nothin' left to say.
My cup grew cold and a teardrop rolled down her cheek,
and I brushed it away...
I remember it all, just like Yesterday.

CH--
And I see it now...
I feel it still.
It's a day I can't forget and never will,
and I hear her voice on the winds of Abilene.
She used to call me Texas, and I called her Norma Jean.

v2
I still see her wavin' through the radiator steam.
She was stranded by the roadside on her way to bigger things.
She threw her bags in back, said she liked my hat,
her name was Marilyn Justine...
I fell into her California dream.

CH--
And I see it now...
I feel it still.
It's a day I can't forget and never will,
and I hear her voice on the winds of Abilene.
She used to call me Texas, and I called her Norma Jean.

refrain...
Yeah, we took a lot of detours on our winding way out west...
livin' for the moment, forgettin' all the rest.
The life that she had waitin' and the one I left behind:
now I'm back here, tryin' to sort it out
one fence-post at a time...

v3
In that coffee shop, the road just stopped, and we faced reality...
the place that she was goin' had no place for me...

CH--And I see it now...
I feel it still.
It's a day I can't forget and never will,
and I hear her voice on the winds of Abilene.
She used to call me Texas, and I called her Norma Jean.

Let's take a look at the first line of the second verse...this is truly classic.

"I still see her wavin' through the radiator steam."

In a single, short sentence, we're told that
1) the speaker is looking into memory.
2) the remembered subject character was calling for attention...
3) "through the radiator steam"...that simple prepositional phrase speaks the volumes that so impress me...we can now see an entire scene, from the smallest of descriptives...a woman, hood of her car up, steam pouring from an overheated radiator (so it's obviously a hot and therefore very bright day)...this is a magnificent example of poetic description!

The rest of the song is good stuff in this light, but that one line is one of the finest examples of short-and-sweet scene setting that I have ever seen. The next line, "She was stranded by the roadside on her way to bigger things...." offers us the perfect and very concise image of a woman travelling with no more certain destination than "a bright future".

"She threw her bags in back, said she liked my hat, "...in those few words we are told that the speaker not only stopped to help, and offered a ride, and that she accepted, but we are very clearly told (without being told at all) that the speaker is a cowboy in a pick-up.

I'm not going to do a full "line-by-line", I think that you are all ready to see what I'm talking about, and I'd like it a lot if some of you were to pick a single line from this (or another) song, and show me all the things that you can find yourself realizing from a very few words...but there's one more line here that, to me, spoke literal volumes of descriptive...maybe it's just my heritage and upbringing...check out these very sparce words, and all the things conveyed in them...

"now I'm back here, tryin' to sort it out
one fence-post at a time..."

Extra points for the student who gives me all of the things I see in this brief and terribly simple description...and that's all for this week's lesson on what makes poetry. In a nutshell...it's the ability to put it---

---in a nutshell.Get what you can from this...I hope you find it helpful.

My Recent Posts · (09/21/08

So good to see the lights on in here again, Eric

I couldn't agree more with this part ...

Poetry is the art of making the language transcend itself, and offering the reader MORE than can be explained in just the meanings of the words and sentences presented. We make use of the sounds and shapes and odd combinations of the words...we use rhythm and tension and contradiction and juxtaposition...we use, even, the visual shape of the poem itself as it flows down the page, to present a whole greater than the sum of its defined parts.

My Recent Posts · (09/21/08

Bravo!! I couldn't agree more. Just a note, though, that not all lyrics are poetry, just as all poetry isn't lyrical, in case any of the readers got that impression. Today's music shows an unfathomable dearth of poetic lyrics, though there is the occasional "gotcha" even in the most metallic of pieces (if you can understand the words). I"ll try to remember to come back to post an example.

:-)

My Recent Posts · (09/26/08

Please do. Meanwhile, another example of lyric that is (IMHO) pure poetry...though in another way and for another reason.

Well, I'll be damned
Here comes your ghost again
But that's not unusual
It's just that the moon is full
And you happened to call
And here I sit
Hand on the telephone
Hearing a voice I'd known
A couple of light years ago
Heading straight for a fall

As I remember your eyes
Were bluer than robin's eggs
My poetry was lousy you said
Where are you calling from?
A booth in the Midwest
Ten years ago I bought you some cufflinks
You brought me something
We both know what memories can bring
They bring diamonds and rust

Well, you burst on the scene, already a legend
The unwashed phenomenon
The original vagabond
You strayed into my arms
And there you stayed
Temporarily lost at sea
The Madonna was yours for free
Yes, the girl on the half-shell
Could keep you unharmed

Now I see you standing with brown leaves falling around
And snow in your hair
Now you're smiling out the window of that crummy hotel
Over Washington Square
Our breath comes out white clouds
Mingles and hangs in the air
Speaking strictly for me
We both could have died then and there

Now you're telling me you're not nostalgic
Then give me another word for it
You who are so good with words
And at keeping things vague
'Cause I need some of that vagueness now
It's all come back too clearly
Yes, I loved you dearly
And if you're offering me diamonds and rust
I've already paid

~Joan Baez

My Recent Posts · (09/26/08

Today's music is a lot of screaming! LOL My sons, like me, have very diverse tastes in music. Those tastes include, but are not limited to, "screamo" so I've been exposed to it. At first listen, it makes me cringe, but as my son pointed out ... listen to the music in the background, not the words, listen to the guitars, the drums ... and yeah, there is some great music behind those screams. And then, if one actually listens to the words there are some that actually are lyrical!

But, I must say ... some of it is just a string of cuss words

Back to your original question, Eric ....

"now I'm back here, tryin' to sort it out
one fence-post at a time..."

Well, this says to me that the trip the two of them took was more than just a road trip, it became an emotional trip, and it was a dead end. They went their separate ways, he returned to his ranch, but he can't easily put her behind him and out of hs mind, she occupies his thoughts constantly, and this conflicts with who he is in his home life, and he has to figure out who he is again.

Or something like that

My Recent Posts · (09/27/08

I'm having trouble locating that example that I know exists... lol. I've got two sons playing different instruments in bands (drums and bass) and attending "gigs" they play at can be a true eye opener (or is it ear opener?)

My Recent Posts · (10/01/08

janmew wrote:
Today's music is a lot of screaming! LOL My sons, like me, have very diverse tastes in music. Those tastes include, but are not limited to, "screamo" so I've been exposed to it. At first listen, it makes me cringe, but as my son pointed out ... listen to the music in the background, not the words, listen to the guitars, the drums ... and yeah, there is some great music behind those screams. And then, if one actually listens to the words there are some that actually are lyrical!

But, I must say ... some of it is just a string of cuss words

Back to your original question, Eric ....

"now I'm back here, tryin' to sort it out
one fence-post at a time..."

Well, this says to me that the trip the two of them took was more than just a road trip, it became an emotional trip, and it was a dead end. They went their separate ways, he returned to his ranch, but he can't easily put her behind him and out of hs mind, she occupies his thoughts constantly, and this conflicts with who he is in his home life, and he has to figure out who he is again.

Or something like that

I wondered if the image was just too 'country'. To me it was so crystal clear.

Yes, they took more than a physical journey together..this I found fairly plain from the first "a teardrop rolled down her cheek". When it came to that riddle-line, "now I'm back here, tryin' to sort it out one fence-post at a time..." I had hoped the reader would realize the physical image of setting fence-posts, and from there, to go on in two directions.

The first, that this cowboy is "back here" where he started, on the ranch and taking refuge from his emotional pain in the back-breaking physical labor of repairing fences.

The second, the figurative interp, the he is (again) back here where he started, having found "the place where she was going had no place for me", and in the process of rebuilding the barriers around his heart that he let down for Norma Jean.

(It's something of an 'audience' thing, I guess...)

Given that Texas and Norma Jean was written for a country audience, I expect that it was more clear than for the general crowd...but while emphasizing that it is up to the writer to write what reaches the readers, there is the reverse; the reader wishing to gain the maximum enjoyment from any write would do well to look beyond the single work and see the background of the poet as well as the poem.

I offer another example, for this illustration.

Tommy

I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o' beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here."
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:
..........O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
..........But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins," when the band begins to play -
..........The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
..........O it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins," when the band begins to play.
I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls,
But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!
..........For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside";
..........But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide -
..........The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
..........O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide.
Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap;
An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.
..........Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, 'ow's yer soul?"
..........But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll -
..........The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
..........O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.
We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints,
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;
..........While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind,"
..........But it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind -
..........There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
..........O it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind.
You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires, an' all:
We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.
..........For it's Tommy this an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!"
..........But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot;
..........An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
..........An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool - you bet that Tommy sees!

~Rudyard Kipling

It may be very obscure to some, but most, on reading this, will realize at least that this is a soldiers' lament about the treatment a soldier receives when NOT involved in active duty. Some might come to realize that Tommy Atkins is actually a generic name for the soldiers of Her Majesty's Army...but who, without a touch of research, would know thqat after the death of Prince Albert, the Queen became popularly known as The Widow at Windsor...and British soldiers as The Widow's Sons, ans so their uniform "The Widow's Uniform"

Kipling was very much the spokesman for the common man and the common soldier in his time, and 'Tommy' spoke as loudly as most when it came to demanding of his audience a level of empathy for those they commonly gave short shrift. Along that line, another country song, this one made by an old rodeo rider acquaintance of mine

Well, I'm just a workin' man's dollar
In the pocket of his old blue jeans
I ain't like my wall street brother
He's in a bank so shiny and clean
Well, I'm faded and I'm wrinkled
Tattered and stained with sweat

But I'm the 1st one called when uncle sam needs a hand with the
National debt
I've been wages for the farm hand
For drivin' an old john deere
I've been laid on a bar in a tavern
To buy a workin' man an ice-cold beer
I've been tipped to a truck-stop waitress
Taped where I was torn
And in the hand of a child I was laid on a plate
In a church on sunday morn

Chorus:

They say I'm the root of all evil
I bring lust, power and greed
But this workin' man's dollar only buys the things
A workin' man really needs

Verse:

Well, they say I'm worth about fifty-cents
In this modern inflated age
But don't tell that to the young man slavin'
To make it on a minimum wage
Or that single workin' mother
She's been scapin' to make ends meet
To make a house a home
Keep food on the table
And shoes on her baby's feet
Well, I know my days are numbered
I'm gettin' threadbare and wearin' thin
And they'll replace me with another
But I'd do it all again
'cause I've seen this great big country
Passed from hand to callused hand
And I've got to say that I'm mighty proud
That I belong to a workin' man

Chorus:

They say I'm the root of all evil
I bring lust, power and greed
But this workin' man's dollar only buys the things
A workin' man really needs

Chris LeDoux

A country song and an old English barrack-poem.

What commonalities can y'all see here?

My Recent Posts · (10/03/08

The first, that this cowboy is "back here" where he started, on the ranch and taking refuge from his emotional pain in the back-breaking physical labor of repairing fences.

The second, the figurative interp, the he is (again) back here where he started, having found "the place where she was going had no place for me", and in the process of rebuilding the barriers around his heart that he let down for Norma Jean.

(It's something of an 'audience' thing, I guess...)

Pretty much what I got out of it, Eric, but I guess my explanation of it didn't explain it that well enough LOL

My Recent Posts · (10/04/08

Is it kosher and ok with you both if I link this topic to another site? I think it's important and a really good question and would like to get a bit more activity on it... especially since I don't seem to be able to get my own ass in gear to do more than hop in and kibitz...

?

I'd be linking to http://www.poetrypages.com

My Recent Posts · (10/04/08

It's ok with me, Heinz, as long as our friends at PP know they would have to join yuku if they actually wanted to post any comment on the topic.

Eric? It is your article

My Recent Posts · (10/20/08

One caveat...Heinzs, you and I also frequent AllPoetry. The Pub at All Poetry is where I go to be a jerk when I have issues, and I'd prefer not to have folks from there (who have bigger issues) knowing where to follow me when I'm feeling more my usual (or unusual) mellow self. Some of them are real sickos...Jan, you may remember one of them followed me home once before?

So Heinzs, try to take a look around there for familiar names, faces, attitudes? If you think someone from AP is at this other place, I'd rather you just copied the article with credit to '
Eric Lee' than link it back here...okay? I'd go there myself to host the discussion (I notice that it's 'your' place) but you see just how rarely I manage to even get here, and I love Jan like my own sister, so I'd likely just be a name without a presence. Two strokes in July have made me even less frequently pleasant company that I was before, and I don't get out much.

My Recent Posts · (10/21/08

Thanks Eric. I will take your suggestion. Sorry to hear about the strokes... recovery is tedious, I know (from family members who've suffered). I'd be proud to host the discussion on my site.

My Recent Posts · (10/21/08

I'd be proud to have you do it.

My Recent Posts · (10/23/08

Well I remember the puppy that followed you home, Eric LOL

I'm happy to see what you two have come up with, since you're both like the big brothers i never had

My Recent Posts · (10/23/08

I'll link here when I get the chance to put it up.

My Recent Posts · (11/01/08

First installment is up:

http://www.poetrypages.co...opic.php?f=19&t=57631

My Recent Posts · (06/23/09

An elusive question at best. i tried a while ago to answer this... at least to myself........

maybe another time.

My Recent Posts · (06/25/09

It might be easier to ask;

What is,(about life) that is not poetry.

My Recent Posts · (07/04/09

Poetry is life, yet not all of life is poetic. The expression of thoughts and feelings is in the poet's venue, but hard "action" may be something else. I don't know.

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So what makes it 'poetry'?

So what makes it 'poetry'?

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